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	<title>Comments on: Mainichi Junk: April 16th, 2008</title>
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	<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/</link>
	<description>Modern Visual Culture Digest</description>
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		<title>By: Shingo</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-79327</link>
		<dc:creator>Shingo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Apr 2008 04:37:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-79327</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;Anon
I find that posting unreasonably absolutist stances on issues from time to time serves nicely to provoke discussion (hence &quot;feces&quot;). I don&#039;t have anything against To Love-Ru in particular, though I&#039;m pretty sure it&#039;s not the type of show I&#039;d enjoy.

Let me try to clarify my position a bit. I don&#039;t like characters with a certain type of weakness - namely, the ones who are weak, passive, incurious, and illogical all rolled into one. I don&#039;t mind protagonists who are disadvantaged, whether by internal flaws or external pressure, but the inability to analyze their situation and act according to what would seem to be their best interest is what frustrates me than anything.

This is kind of hard to explain with good examples because I&#039;ve been avoiding shows that feature this sort of protagonist, but I can provide an example of a weak hero who I admire - the protagonist of eroge &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.blackrainbow.jp/br/jutsu2/chara06.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Saiminjutsu 2&lt;/a&gt;. He&#039;s physically and socially weak, but he&#039;s intelligent, and when given tremendous power he rationally and effectively uses it to his advantage.

Put another way - yes, I like stories about heros (or anti-heroes). Guilty as charged. I&#039;d much rather follow the adventures of an on-screen alter ego who has bigger problems than which girl he&#039;ll get caught with in a compromising situation that she initiated. Alternatively, I like stories about relationships that are more complex than &quot;he likes her breasts and she likes him because he was nice to her when they were kids only he doesn&#039;t remember that now&quot;. I also like stories that are mindless fun without any irritants, and weak male protagonists can be a &lt;em&gt;big irritant.&lt;/em&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;I’m willing to bet ToLoveRu will have some level of character development during its run, likely even relevant to the plot.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
In the end, what it comes down to is that I&#039;m not willing to make this bet. I simply don&#039;t have the time these days to wager that a show that isn&#039;t the least bit interesting to me within the first few episodes will get good enough later on to justify the initial time spent getting to the good bits. I wish I did have this kind of time available, but I have to prioritize, and shows like To Love-Ru get shoved pretty deep in the pile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>>>Anon<br />
I find that posting unreasonably absolutist stances on issues from time to time serves nicely to provoke discussion (hence &#8220;feces&#8221;). I don&#8217;t have anything against To Love-Ru in particular, though I&#8217;m pretty sure it&#8217;s not the type of show I&#8217;d enjoy.</p>
<p>Let me try to clarify my position a bit. I don&#8217;t like characters with a certain type of weakness &#8211; namely, the ones who are weak, passive, incurious, and illogical all rolled into one. I don&#8217;t mind protagonists who are disadvantaged, whether by internal flaws or external pressure, but the inability to analyze their situation and act according to what would seem to be their best interest is what frustrates me than anything.</p>
<p>This is kind of hard to explain with good examples because I&#8217;ve been avoiding shows that feature this sort of protagonist, but I can provide an example of a weak hero who I admire &#8211; the protagonist of eroge <a href="http://www.blackrainbow.jp/br/jutsu2/chara06.html" rel="nofollow">Saiminjutsu 2</a>. He&#8217;s physically and socially weak, but he&#8217;s intelligent, and when given tremendous power he rationally and effectively uses it to his advantage.</p>
<p>Put another way &#8211; yes, I like stories about heros (or anti-heroes). Guilty as charged. I&#8217;d much rather follow the adventures of an on-screen alter ego who has bigger problems than which girl he&#8217;ll get caught with in a compromising situation that she initiated. Alternatively, I like stories about relationships that are more complex than &#8220;he likes her breasts and she likes him because he was nice to her when they were kids only he doesn&#8217;t remember that now&#8221;. I also like stories that are mindless fun without any irritants, and weak male protagonists can be a <em>big irritant.</em></p>
<blockquote><p>I’m willing to bet ToLoveRu will have some level of character development during its run, likely even relevant to the plot.</p></blockquote>
<p>In the end, what it comes down to is that I&#8217;m not willing to make this bet. I simply don&#8217;t have the time these days to wager that a show that isn&#8217;t the least bit interesting to me within the first few episodes will get good enough later on to justify the initial time spent getting to the good bits. I wish I did have this kind of time available, but I have to prioritize, and shows like To Love-Ru get shoved pretty deep in the pile.</p>
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		<title>By: Anon</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-79318</link>
		<dc:creator>Anon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Apr 2008 04:08:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-79318</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;Shingo
So less loquaciously, you don&#039;t like weak characters? You prefer the archetypal &#039;super&#039; protagonist who, in a contrived way, manages to carry a plot, however so unoriginal? I find the contrary much more &quot;human&quot;; much more &quot;real&quot;, than some robot of fiction. Even in a gag anime, a spineless character still has a role relevant to the plot or other characters, and that role often changes as the series progresses.

Simply because a show doesn&#039;t contain elements associated with traditional story-telling does not mean that it has no value outside of entertainment. I&#039;m willing to bet ToLoveRu will have some level of character development during its run, likely even relevant to the plot. 

It seems as though you&#039;re letting some heavy bias slip through into your judgement of fanservice/gag/harem anime in general, ToLoveRu inparticular.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;Shingo<br />
So less loquaciously, you don&#8217;t like weak characters? You prefer the archetypal &#8216;super&#8217; protagonist who, in a contrived way, manages to carry a plot, however so unoriginal? I find the contrary much more &#8220;human&#8221;; much more &#8220;real&#8221;, than some robot of fiction. Even in a gag anime, a spineless character still has a role relevant to the plot or other characters, and that role often changes as the series progresses.</p>
<p>Simply because a show doesn&#8217;t contain elements associated with traditional story-telling does not mean that it has no value outside of entertainment. I&#8217;m willing to bet ToLoveRu will have some level of character development during its run, likely even relevant to the plot. </p>
<p>It seems as though you&#8217;re letting some heavy bias slip through into your judgement of fanservice/gag/harem anime in general, ToLoveRu inparticular.</p>
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		<title>By: wildarmsheero</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78446</link>
		<dc:creator>wildarmsheero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 03:47:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78446</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;Shingo
I will continue to pester you about this :argh:</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;Shingo<br />
I will continue to pester you about this :argh:</p>
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		<title>By: Coco the Bean</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78432</link>
		<dc:creator>Coco the Bean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 02:42:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78432</guid>
		<description>More Maritan?  Heck yes!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>More Maritan?  Heck yes!</p>
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		<title>By: Shingo</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78429</link>
		<dc:creator>Shingo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 02:24:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78429</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;loplop
And what a work it is! I&#039;m very happy with the way his style is heading these days. :3

&gt;&gt;Link
You know you want to. Feel your willpower crumbling...

&gt;&gt;Al
I&#039;m allergic to protagonists with no rational agency, especially those of the wussy shota variety. I can&#039;t bear to watch shows with plots driven at their core by the actions of a passive individual unable to assert rational self-interest or actively deal with events in his or her environment in a way that he or she deems beneficial to his or her long-term (or even short term) wellbeing. Especially ones where through the entire story arc the characters don&#039;t develop or progress demonstrably beyond how they&#039;re depicted in the first episode.

This is where the doujin comes in.

&gt;&gt;DJnerate
I&#039;ll proudly stand up for my side of the fecal fence any day. There are less whiny indecisive kiddies over here.

I don&#039;t expect To Love-Ru will develop according to anything other than the traditional pattern of non-development in these sorts of stories, but if something interesting happens that fundamentally changes the status quo I might be interested in picking it up.

&gt;&gt;wildarmsheero
Maybe if the loli becomes a muchi-muchi kyonyuu na onee-san. :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>>>loplop<br />
And what a work it is! I&#8217;m very happy with the way his style is heading these days. :3</p>
<p>>>Link<br />
You know you want to. Feel your willpower crumbling&#8230;</p>
<p>>>Al<br />
I&#8217;m allergic to protagonists with no rational agency, especially those of the wussy shota variety. I can&#8217;t bear to watch shows with plots driven at their core by the actions of a passive individual unable to assert rational self-interest or actively deal with events in his or her environment in a way that he or she deems beneficial to his or her long-term (or even short term) wellbeing. Especially ones where through the entire story arc the characters don&#8217;t develop or progress demonstrably beyond how they&#8217;re depicted in the first episode.</p>
<p>This is where the doujin comes in.</p>
<p>>>DJnerate<br />
I&#8217;ll proudly stand up for my side of the fecal fence any day. There are less whiny indecisive kiddies over here.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t expect To Love-Ru will develop according to anything other than the traditional pattern of non-development in these sorts of stories, but if something interesting happens that fundamentally changes the status quo I might be interested in picking it up.</p>
<p>>>wildarmsheero<br />
Maybe if the loli becomes a muchi-muchi kyonyuu na onee-san. :D</p>
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		<title>By: wildarmsheero</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78421</link>
		<dc:creator>wildarmsheero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 01:45:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78421</guid>
		<description>I think you should watch Kure-nai :(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you should watch Kure-nai :(</p>
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		<title>By: DJnerate</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78416</link>
		<dc:creator>DJnerate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 01:06:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78416</guid>
		<description>Genre: feces describes half the shows in every season. It just depends on which side of the sewer you&#039;re on.

The first couple of episodes were okay, but if things go the way they usually do, it&#039;ll eventually turn into yet more fodder for the fanboys. Get doujins, move on, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Genre: feces describes half the shows in every season. It just depends on which side of the sewer you&#8217;re on.</p>
<p>The first couple of episodes were okay, but if things go the way they usually do, it&#8217;ll eventually turn into yet more fodder for the fanboys. Get doujins, move on, etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Al</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78376</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 22:40:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78376</guid>
		<description>To Love-Ru,Genre: feces. *snort* Shingo, tell us how you really feel.
Regardless of the merits of the show the design of Lala is really cute. There&#039;s supposed to be a figure of her in her main costume coming up if I&#039;m not mistaken. I&#039;d like to get that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Love-Ru,Genre: feces. *snort* Shingo, tell us how you really feel.<br />
Regardless of the merits of the show the design of Lala is really cute. There&#8217;s supposed to be a figure of her in her main costume coming up if I&#8217;m not mistaken. I&#8217;d like to get that.</p>
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		<title>By: Link</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78375</link>
		<dc:creator>Link</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 22:39:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78375</guid>
		<description>Oh wow, if I collected figures, I&#039;d buy that Alter Vita in a heartbeat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh wow, if I collected figures, I&#8217;d buy that Alter Vita in a heartbeat.</p>
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		<title>By: loplop</title>
		<link>http://heiseidemocracy.com/2008/04/16/mainichi-junk-april-16th-2008/comment-page-1/#comment-78326</link>
		<dc:creator>loplop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 17:18:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heiseidemocracy.com/?p=6240#comment-78326</guid>
		<description>A new work by Sumeragi Kohaku?  That will have to be purchased for sure . . . .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A new work by Sumeragi Kohaku?  That will have to be purchased for sure . . . .</p>
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